Leave no man behind

I have been reading through your website off and on during the last few months now - it's a fascinating place. I have a question you may wish to put to your forum. It is one specifically for those who seriously question the very foundation of Christianity. Before I ask, a brief synopsis;

Philosophers from Kant to Wittgenstein, Descartes to Russell, have all added their perspectives of religion, some damning others less so. There is a distinctive line in modern philosophy of religion between those who outwardly denounce the plausibility of Christianity or deities at all, and those who occupy themselves with defining the thought processes that lead to this type of conclusion rather than actually concluding.

Although not a philosopher, Thomas Paine's literary brilliance culminated in The Age of Reason - a truly masterful piece of writing and argumentation - in which he repeatedly states his respect for those whose opinion may differ from his (a not too surprising fact coming from the man who gave us the basis for the UN Declaration of Human Rights). But not unlike Bertrand Russell I feel, Paine also frequently flirts with the idea that we ought to fight the farce that is Christianity. In some instances he is quite belligerent (passionate?) in his rebuke of those choosing to emurse themselves in this "wretched scam".

Herein lies the dilemma: as people who believe that Christianity is at the very most a temporal contortion of pagan tradition and political happenstance, responsible for some of the worst atrcocities in man's histoy, is there not a concomitant moral/ humanist obligation to "de-convert" Christians we come into contact with?

Your site is designed to encourage and help exChristians to move on and build their lives without the religious crutch. But what about those left behind? Does the Humanist movement need to adopt a policy of engagement? And if so, what would be the nature of its approach and from where would it derive its ultimate legitimacy? I find these the most pressing and frustrating questions.

I thought I would throw it out there and see what thoughts come back.



Hey Preacher, Leave those kids alone!

Joel Atkinson

I have a right to write this.

You see, I am an insider...an eye-witness. Critics will say that this is an attack and they will be found correct. For that is precisely what it is. However, it is also a defense. It is indeed both of these things, and, frankly speaking, I do not see a way that the two can be separate, at least not in this instance. Any attack is in truth the most aggressive defense of something very important to you. So let the critics try and try to separate the two. In these writings, at least, the two will be one and the same. An attack on the so-called Church of Christ and a defense of the so-called Lost in the world, for whom the Church of Christ constantly seeks their conversion or destruction, whichever comes first.

Let them lie and say they do not seek this. If this is truly what they are saying, then they disavow the very sacred and most perfect book they claim to obey. For throughout that book, the writers instill in the readers a duty, nay, a need to convert everyone and anyone to their way. Furthermore, throughout their book one can constantly find the theme of destruction of all who oppose them and their god, or is it gods, they can't ever seem to agree on that one, can they? So, you see, any christian in this world who even half-ass follows the book is either wishing for your conversion or your death and eternal roasting in the bowels of the great hellacious barbecue pit, manned by Chef Lucifer himself, that wicked little devil who taught us how to read. How to...disobey. For that would be a terrible thing for a people to do, wouldn't it, governments of the world?

Large corporations and church-armies? To...disobey. To...revolt. To...rise up and take the life that is ours by right. Of birth. Of breath. Of fire and wind and all that is truly sacred in this real world, the only world we have, not the fucking heavenly one. This world, dammit. Face it or leave it, but do one or the other and cease your efforts to make miserable all of those who choose to be a man or a woman and stand up to it, facing its horror and beauty alike. Let's be honest here, we'd go for a rapturish abduction of you guys. Sure. We want you gone, anyway. We're sick and tired of your damnable lie and your filthy, slutty book.

Jesus talked about living and all you can do is focus on his death. It is a disgrace to his name the way you wear it on your fucking t-shirts and dare to tell the hurting and the lame that that exact same name loves them. Why should they care if he loves them? He's dead. Your kind killed him, not the jews or the romans, but narrow-minded bigots full of hatred. The question is, do you love them? You see, you're actually living. Breathing. You know, the usual things we equate with life. So, do YOU love them, with or without a god to hide behind? If Jesus walked this earth today I believe the church as a whole would kill him quick as they would Osama Bin Laden himself. You're all full of shit and we all know it so get over it and move on.

If you love the man so much then do what the fucking hell he said do and don't judge, don't fear, love your neighbor, actually become like a child again instead of praying a stupid-ass little prayer and then pretending like something great and wonderful happened. Santa Claus doesn't bring presents to little poor kids so grow up. You want to do something then fucking do it, whether it be feed the hungry without feeding them your selfrighteous vomit or getting it over with and waging actual war on all unbelievers, not just the muslims. What a stupid, stupid part of our populace. We've got a freakin religious fanatic in control of our country and you step out on the limb and predict a coming apocalypse. Fucking duh! Have you ever heard of the idea of enacting the stories you read? Especially when you believe those stories are absolute divine truth.

Hello! Is any of this sinking in? You guys are the ones who are going to bring about the apocalypse, because you believe in that story so much it is inevitable that you will make it happen, at least the world getting blown all to shit part. I'm afraid that the heaven and hell part and all of that bullshit just are not gonna happen, as you'll soon see immediately following your precious apocalypse. When the earth dies because everybody's tossing nuclear bombs around like so many baseballs, we'll all soon see that if we ever had a soul, then it was surely somehow connected to the earth and the universe around us, within us.

But we always separated ourselves from it, and you guys have always been so fast to assassinate the character of anyone who dares love a tree or see god in the butterfly as well as the cross. Did you even read the gospels, people? You know it was the most religious people who killed your king? The most unbending, unflexible people. They're the ones who crucified your godforsaken savior. If you remember the stories, the Lost ones were his friends. And my case is closed, Mr. McDowell.

My Evidence that demands a verdict is his church and their horrible, hateful, evil book. And people like you.


I was never a Christian. My father was raised Catholic and my mom Baptist. They got married in a Methodist church and I went to a Lutheran congregation a few times as a child. Even as young as 4, the atmosphere bothered me; The abstract sermons, the rudeness of some children during youth group. The tight dress clothes seemed out of place, why dress up to find out what makes us human?

I asked my mother if I could stop going when I was ab out 5, because it was boring and I just had an odd feeling about it. The only other time I went into a church was a week-long Bible study at the same chruch building when I was probably 9. The arts and crafts annoyed me and seemed like busy work. I couldn't grasp the attitudes of the other children. I dropped out after 2 days. My brother conintued to attend, and I got phone calls, postcards and letters from the Pastor for 4 months afterwards. I got very angry at him for not leaving me alone.

I never professed Jesus, and always had an interest in biology, even at 6. I was the classic 80's dinosaur toddler, spouting out names and figures. In ther beginningof high-school I "became" Pagan and started expressing openly my probloems with Christianity. I later realized I didn't believe in any of those God(desses) either and just became my own personal mix of atheist-agnostic, not really knowing but feeling there wasn't a deity. I didn't care, I would be judged based on all the things I did here, which were comprised of a lot of volunteer work.

To top it off I was never a Chistian,I just love reading this site and wanted to espouse the great

email: work.otaku_faith at @yahoo.com

Why can't we Think?

Due to problems with the server, this is the only way I could get a comment in. First, let me say that I am and as far as I can tell always will be a follower of Jesus. I dislike the lable "Christian" because of the stigmas most people in my culture attach to it. In addition to being a Jesus-follower, I am also an adherant of the Gothic subculture, a subculture that does not smile on blind faith.

I just wanted to thank the webmaster for his stunning commentary on the lack of intellectual life in the Christian community. Only among Goths, thier sympathizers, a few select Bible college professors have I found total acceptance for my somewhat unorthodox approach and my insistance on good, logical reasons to back beliefs. I may disagree with your conclusions, Dave, but I totally understand the thought process that led you to them. You and your work have as much if my full support as I can give without denying the things I myself believe.

-Melanie Fellion, 24, Student.

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