Thursday, December 30, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

stop spreading Satan's lies

Dear webmaster:

I urge you to stop spreading Satan's lies to the world. Look around you and see what's happening in the news: it's the Books of Daniel and Revelation coming true before our very eyes! You have no idea what you are doing to yourself and others by perpetuating this junk on your website. You are very lost and the time to get yourself right with your Creator is getting shorter by the day.

carmen@therefinersfire.org
Carmen

Tuesday, December 28, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

all that have left Christinanity were never truely born again

After reading several stories from here, I have concluded that all that have left Christinanity, were never truely born again anyway. Eighty to ninety precent of the professions for Christ are false professions.

Many here don't believe in hell, but if I stood in the middle of the road and didn't believe in trucks, I would still get hit by a truck. So what I believe or not believe in does not change the reality of it. If you put a gun to my head and I laugh at you and tell you I don't believe in bullets.

What if there were a slight chance of hell, would you really want to take that chance? If I offered you 10 Million dollars for both of your eyes, would you take it? Why would you put so much value on you eyes which are the windows of the soul, but place no value on the soul itself? For what shall it gain you if you gain the whole world, but loose your own soul?

When I was 18, I had only been in church about 3 time my whole 18 year life. I grew up on a farm and one day while putting up hay I heard about a revival at a small country church. I asked my parents if we could go and they said we could if we finished the work. We finished the work and went that night. After the preacher finished preaching, an alter call was given. As I stood there, the Holy Spirit drawed me. I could see with out a savior, I was doomed to hell and all my good works could not save me. Tears ran down my face and I squeezed the back of the pew till my knuckles turned white. I wanted a new life in Christ but I didn't want to give up my old life. I new I was lost without Christ, he paid for my sins. I went forward and accepted Christ as my personal savior. I am not perfect, I am a sinner saved by grace. I do make mistakes, but Jesus is always there to forgive me and help me through. Jesus is real and he lives in my heart.

The only way you can turn from Jesus is you never knew him in the first place. My heart pains for you. I will be praying for you all.

Herb revherb.m@juno.com

Saturday, December 25, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

Wow...

You are one very sad, sorry, unhappy person. I really hope that you find something better to do with your time than making fun of Christians. I laughed my butt of as I read your No True Christians article. That was so incoherent in so many ways, it wasn't even funny. But it was very typical of a person who TRIES to use the Bible against itself, despite the fact that they have a very limited knowledge. Anyone can present crap to a group of people who also don't know what they are talking about. Pardon the pun, but you had better pray that there is no God. Could you imagine if you died, and actually were judged. What would you say? Yikes. And by the way...people aren't perfect, and they do make mistakes, people want to follow God's commandments to a tee, but we fail sometimes because we aren't perfect. We can't be perfect...

~John
Believer

PS - Since Jesus' life focused primarily on living for helping other people, and providing compassion...He probably wouldn't care if someone wasn't trying to get us to pay him 10 dollars as part of some lame scheme for money. They didn't have faceless, cowardly, creepy, and strange internet folk back in that day. Peace.

Thursday, December 16, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

you were NEVER ever a Christian

One thing is for sure, you were NEVER ever a Christian to begin with.

You really need to be saved. This web site doesn't really prove anything, what a waist of time and effort. Maybe you should prey to God with an open heart, I'm sure he will forgive you. You still have time...that's if you're still alive by the time I send this message.

Good luck with that bud.

Tuesday, December 14, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

i know that he loves me

I'm a full time christian,living my life in the paths of the lord.Recently i went to church and lerned how to look at the world with spiritual eyes,how to open my heart to all those around,and you know why because i am walking as a lamb of god with the lords love and peace constantly flowing in my spirit and guiding me to not only accomplish all i was set on earth for but to also grow in the spirit.I was a suicidal soul lost in the world influenced by people and always full of depression and hate in my heart beacause of demons that attacked me and trick me........because they do not offer love and peacefulness in life........i attempted to commit suicide,and i realized then how beautiful life truly was,it was a death experience i will never forget because i realized who was my friend,who made me feel good,and who gave me that father loving friendship i always searched for......this was jesus.....ever since ,i died in the flesh and i began to breth once again in the spirit.....now i live a life full of excitement full of joy full of MEANING and you know why beca use at the end i will be eternally with the lord and i know that he loves me forever and ever.

Friday, December 10, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

The Virus God Experiment

Imagine for a moment that man was created by Virus God for one purpose. That man was created in order to be host to viruses.

Without human hosts viruses would die. Man even got a brain, consciousness, awareness and so on in order to facilitate human interaction thereby facilitating the spread and survival of viruses.

Man reproduces itself by means of rather intimate personal relations in order that viruses can find new hosts, new food sources. Even new tiny man/things which are of course good hosts for viruses, not possessing such a great deal of protection against them.

Virus God even created a lesser Man God so that man could feel somehow special in the universe, and can even feel boastful enough that THEY were created in God's image and are the highest form of life. This also greatly reduced the possibility that host man would ever even imagine that they were merely created for the sole purpose of viruses.

The Man God, at the will of Virus God commands those under him to go forth and multiply even includes sanctions against loving others of the same sex because it doesnt create new virus hosts.

No need to worry about heaven or hell my dears. Once youre dead, there will be other man hosts so that viruses will always be provided for. Virus God will never leave them nor forsake them.

Maybe, maybe not....just playing anyway. HA!

Sharon

Kill Your God

I came across your site and I just wanted to say bravo! I too have a story of once being a christian for 16 years and after listening to a performance of classical music, I realized there was more spirit in the notes, than I ever felt reading the bible, going to church or praying to the actors of that poorly constructed play called christianity.

I felt so strongly in my change that I wrote a diary, collected poems, and eventually, became what one would call a witch; just without the ignorant banter you find in most nature based faiths. My diary became a book, and it has just been published: www.wastelandpress.net/God.html.

I didn't post this on your message board because I didn't want you to think it was a sly attempt at advertising :)

Thank you though for your work. I wish I had seen your site when I was going through the process of my own spiritual cleansing.

In Wisdom,

Kurtz
rev_messe_noir at yahoo dot com

Monday, November 29, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

...never a christian...

I really hope that some of you will email me to explain why you are no longer following Christ. I am still a Christian, and I pray that I never turn away from the faith because if I do that proves that I never was a Christian to begin with(read 1st John). Contact me, and inform me of your views. Please challenge my thoughts. Thank all of you for your time.

Kevin King
romans10vs9@hotmail.com

Friday, November 26, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

What's All the Fuss?

sent in by Michael J Fowler

When I was eight, my mother admitted that there was no Santa Claus. So followed the rest of the fairy tales.

As I grew older, I noticed that the followers of the "Prince of Peace" seemed to do a lot of killing.

I have quietly been an atheist for over forty years.

I have been a critical care nurse and a firefighter/paramedic because of my belief that humanity must help itself. In my careers I have had to "feign christianity" to keep my jobs secure. I have read more of the bible than most xtians that I know.

After I was seriously injured, we moved to AZ. Ever since the neighbors found out about our (non) beliefs we have been harassed; tires punctured, property vandalized, my son was assaulted at school,etc.

We are considering emigration to a country that allows freedom of thought as I am too old, crippled and in pain to fight anymore.

Thursday, November 25, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

JESUS STILL LOVES YOU

sent in by Philippe

  • Regardless of your beliefs, your hurting, your pain ... Jesus still loves you.
  • Regardless of your upbringing, your stance on morals, money or sex... Jesus still loves you.
  • Regardless of your views, your anger, your hate... Jesus still loves you

Deep down you know that and you know you are running away from Him, if Jesus didn't care about you why would he take your sin - all your sin - and hang on the cross for you.

If you were the only person on this earth Jesus still would have come down, took your sins on his shoulders and died in your place.

You had a better birth than the Son of God and you surely will have a better death - if you were seriously bothered about the Bible and it's teaching you would have re-started your relationship with God by inviting Jesus back into your life and asking God Himself.

It's true religion lets us down, church lets us down, the world lets you down and christians let you down - but you know like me that in reality

Jesus is faithful and will NEVER let you down.

As for God's love he doesn't give it to His favourite religious people but to everyone, even those He knows will reject it - that is Amazing Grace. Romans 5:8 'God demonstrates His own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us'. Not when we were followers of Jesus but when we rejected Him, hated him, and made websites encouraging others to hate him too. When all is said and done this thing remains Jesus loves you.

It is finished... So follow!

quick_flip@yahoo.co.uk

Sunday, November 21, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

Something I'd Like to Share

sent in by Ed Babinski

Why do so many human beings assume so much in general, and have such difficulty even getting members of their own family to agree with them on trifling matters, yet seek to evangelize the entire world and tell everyone "what's what?" I am convinced that the ability to communicate is an art and takes far more patience and practice than most others. The mere fact that the world is filled with difficulties in communication, and that such difficulty is not necessarily due to "sin," constitutes one more reason why I do not believe "God's Word" determines where everyone goes for eternity. For instance, some conservative Christians argue in favor of hell by calling it “God’s great compliment.” Surely there is some confusion and miscommunication somewhere if you have to use the word "compliment" in such a fashion. If hell is such a “compliment” then what does God do when he wants to “insult” somebody?
---------
Given headaches, backaches, toothaches, strains, scrapes, breaks, cuts, rashes, burns, bruises, PMS, fatigue, hunger, odors, molds, colds, yeast, parasites, viruses, cancers, genetic defects, blindness, deafness, paralysis, mental illness, ugliness, ignorance, miscommunications, embarrassments, unrequited love, dashed hopes, boredom, hard labor, repetitious labor, accidents, old age, senility, fires, floods, earthquakes, typhoons, tornadoes, hurricanes and volcanoes, I can not see how anyone, after they are dead, deserves “eternal punishment” as well.
---------
When I was a boy I heard tell of an old farmer in Vermont. He was dying.
The minister was at his bedside -- asked him if he was a Christian, if he was prepared to die. The old man answered that he had made no preparation, that he was not a Christian, that he had never done anything but work. The preacher said that he could give him no hope unless he had faith in Christ, and that if he had no faith his soul would certainly be lost. The old man was not frightened. He was perfectly calm. In a weak and broken voice he said, “Mr. Preacher, I suppose you noticed my farm. My wife and I came here more than fifty years ago. We were just married. It was a forest then and the land was covered with stones. I cut down the trees, burned the logs, picked up the stones, and laid the walls. My wife spun and wove and worked every moment. We raised and educated our children -- denied ourselves. During all these years my wife never had a good dress, or a decent bonnet. I never had a good suit of clothes. We lived on the plainest food. Our hands, our bodies are deformed by toil. We never had a vacation. We loved each other and the children. That is the only luxury we ever had. Now I am about to die and you ask me if I am prepared. Mr.
Preacher, I have no fear of the future, no terror of any other world.
There may be such a place as hell -- but if there is, you never can make me believe that it’s any worse than old Vermont.”
- Robert Ingersoll, “Why I Am An Agnostic”
-------
It is strange to me that people can consign others to hell without a scruple. One only has to remember a toothache, not to wish it eternally on anyone.
- Lucy Daugalis (daugalis@arcom.com.au)
----------
When all has been considered, it seems to me to be the irresistible intuition that infinite punishment for finite sin would be unjust, and therefore wrong. We feel that even weak and erring Man would shrink from such an act. And we cannot conceive of God as acting on a lower standard of right and wrong.
- Lewis Carroll (author of Alice in Wonderland), “Eternal Punishment,”
Diversions and Digressions of Lewis Carroll
----------
Do I believe in eternal punishment? Hell no. I always believed God could get his revenge in far less time.
- Robert Ingersoll
----------
An idea, which has terrified millions, claims that some of us will go to a place called Hell, where we will suffer eternal torture. This does not scare me because, when I try to imagine a Mind behind this universe, I cannot conceive that Mind, usually called “God,” as totally mad. I mean, guys, compare that “God” with the worst monsters you can think of -- Adolph Hitler, Joe Stalin, that sort of guy. None of them ever inflicted more than finite pain on their victims. Even de Sade, in his sado-masochistic fantasy novels, never devised an unlimited torture. The idea that the Mind of Creation (if such exists) wants to torture some of its critters for endless infinities of infinities seems too absurd to take seriously. Such a deranged Mind could not create a mud hut, much less the exquisitely mathematical universe around us. If such a monster-God did exist, the sane attitude would consist of practicing the Buddhist virtue of compassion. Don’t give way to hatred: try to understand and forgive him. Maybe He will recover his wits some day.
- Robert Anton Wilson, “Cheerful Reflections on Death and Dying,” Gnoware, February 1999

-------------

ORTHODOX CHRISTIAN RESPONSES TO WHAT I SENT ABOVE

Alexanian:: God does not force anyone to jump.

DAVE: May I suggest a different approach to hell? I think it is God's loving provision for those who would be in incredible pain in the presence of absolute holiness. Hell is the place where, not being conscious of God, eternal souls will be most comfortable. But it must be different for those who did not know from those who knew and rejected.
Dave

------------------

ED: Dear Alex and Dave, your responses above are evidently just as ad hoc as my own reasoning.

Alex appears ignorant of the passages in the Word of God that do depict God "forcing people to jump" as it were, in a variety of situations, both Old Testament and New. Perhaps Alex has never read Calvin or Luther either, or classical Catholic literature on hell and the Bible.

And Dave's depiction of hell as "God's loving provision" is something I fail to understand. He's using "love" in an entirely different fashion from the way I understand the word -- having souls hidden away in closets for eternity, to avoid encountering a God who cannot help tearing them to pieces by his mere presence? It's just another way of trying to depict orthodoxy without being too offensive to others. Well, if God can't be in these people's presence, what about others? Angels, other human souls?
Someone could conceivably reach those closet cases, or at least share tea with them from time to time, listen to them. Everybody could use a friend when they're down.

Likewise, as I pointed out to Alex, if "hell is comfortable" then how is it hell? Why ought a person, as Jesus taught, cut off their own hand rather than go there, even metaphorically speaking? And then adding the threats about apostates like myself who "knew and rejected" how "different" my punishment is going to be. Really, Dave.

I have studied many NDE's and spoken to people who have had them, and found no evidence that "Born againers" have cornered the market on experiencing love in the next life. Hellish NDEs are the exception, not
the rule.

Also, I believe I brought up the subject of universalist Christians in Christian history (many in the early church), and also George Macdonald's universalism.

I like living on this planet, working, my job isn't so bad and has many benefits, and I don't mind so much people having opinions different from my own, though I appreciate those who are able to moderate themselves in speech and express themselves well. This world is neither heaven nor hell, but something else. And surely any infinite being that could create the present world could also create one like it that lasted infinity instead of creating a "hell."

Seems to me that the options that one might come up with as an infinite being are more diverse than either "heaven" or "hell."

In fact, I'll go so far as to say that any religion that can only think in terms of "heaven" or "hell" is gonna be a haven for manic-depressives.

I recall Howard Storm's vision of the afterlife in his NDE. The fundamentalist christian from the southern U.S. died and arrived in the afterlife in a place created especially for them, to ease their transition, a place with a church on a green grassy knoll. People from other religions with other beliefs and from other parts of the world were treated to equally respectful scenarios and the truth of a wider more universal spirituality was only gradually revealled to each of them.

Or there's the old joke about St. Peter giving the new arrivals to heaven a tour of the premises, and there on a cloud below them was a bunch of people with paper bags over their heads. St. Peter whispered to the folks in the tour bus, "Please don't make too much noise as we pass over this cloud, it's the Born Again Christians, they think they're the only ones up here."

Time and God are the best teachers. And that's what love is really about, throughout eternity. "Love never fails..." 1 Cor.

Or as was engraved on the tombstone of two ancient astronomers "We have loved the stars far too much to fear the night."

Cheers,

edwardtbabinski.us

Monday, November 15, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

Wife Swap!

Greetings!

I am writing in the hopes that someone affiliated with your site might be interested in appearing on a new ABC television series. The show, (which has the rather salacious title of Wife Swap), has two mothers exchange families for 2 weeks, such that both can explore another family’s values and lifestyle, and share their perspective too. It’s a format that has won numerous awards in the UK, and been critically acclaimed on this side of the Atlantic as well.

We are always searching for intelligent, opinionated individuals from a diversity of backgrounds. Currently, we are eager to feature a family headed by parents who are raising their children without imposing religious beliefs on them. In a society where non-theistic individuals can be marginalized, participating would provide an opportunity to put a human face to the atheist or humanist perspective.

Is there anyway that you might be able to help us find some families? This could be as simple as a message about us in a mass email, a notice in a newsletter, or sharing the information with anyone you know personally that might be interested.

Anyone interested can call or email me directly. They would not be committing to the show in any way. I would simply give them more details and answer any questions they might have.

Thanks for taking the time to read this, and please give me a call or write should you have any questions or concerns.

Kind regards,
Stacy Wood
Associate Producer
Tel: (212) 404-1472
Email: stacy.wood@rdfmedia.com
www.WifeSwapTVShow.com

'One of the most entertaining new entries in reality TV, Wife Swap reminds us that the American living room is as fascinating a laboratory of human emotions as Borneo or the corporate boardroom.' Time Magazine

'Wife Swap is promisingly sly and serious, funny and flabbergasting. It's a reality show, yes, but also in its way a fascinating pop sociological experiment, one that increases in complexity and impact as it goes along.' Washington Post

Friday, November 05, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

Jesus is my parachute!

As I have browsed this site and read the 'testimonies' of the uncoverting people here...I notice several things. Most here believe Christianity is a set of rules or guidelines that you live by. Every group of people gathered has expectations of those within the gathering and to not adhere to those expectations means you are somewhat ousted from the group....except in "your" churches where you expected these people to accept you no matter how you presented yourself...people are people and they fail each other.

So here is what the truth really is about. Stop meeting the creed and meet God. It's about trusting IN JESUS not about what you can do for God.

Stop following people or churches and their dogma's. Jesus said take up your cross and follow me...not Tom, Dick, and Harry.

The Bible says you will be presented with the trial of your faith in order to prove to you, not God whether you really have trusted him and have been indwelt by the Holy Spirit. Sadly, most of you here know the answer to this question. You were never saved. That is why you didn't last. That is why you got offended and quit...a person who truly has the Spirit of God in them cannot quit....What is in him will not be overcome by anything in this world. Those who do not overcome the trials or at least get through them with there faith in god either stronger or more resolute...never had true faith in the first place.....because of the reason I stated before.

Here is the deal. 10 commandment show you and I are all guilty...everyone has lied, everyone has stolen, everyone has at some time lusted after that girl or guy that we wanted so bad. All have sinned. What churches are not teaching is that going to church, being baptised..it's all useless. You cannot fill a hole that goes on for eternity and that is the penalty for your sin. You have offended a pure, holy, infinite God. yeah, I know he is a God of love....but he is thrice HOLY....so his holiness outweighs his love 3 times. That's something else churches neglect. If I gave you a glass of water with a drop of sewage in it, it would turn your stomache and you'd be offended at me for even suggesting you drink it...yet you ask God to accept you with all your death from sin, into his holy eternity of life. Since the wages of sin is death, what can you do...you're dead. Dead men do not do anything...all that you do is null, void, vanity....God says even your works of righteousness are as filthy rags.

You are left with a question. You have tried church. You have tried putting Jesus on for this life and he failed you because things got tough, people didn't love you like they should have and life is just plain unfair. Join the club. Don't think I say this without my fair share of trials. In the last 6 years I have went through things that I couldn't imagine and are far worse than anything I've read on this site yet. But I am still a Christian because I didn't put Jesus on like suit for this life...I put Jesus on as a parachute for eternity...big difference in perspective.

Forget all this stuff about Jesus helping you with your marriage or your finances or whatever.....none of that applies to you until Jesus saves your soul from Hell.
The little banner over there talks about everyone being God's beloved creations and how could a good God send his beloved creations to Hell. Because he is HOLY and you are a rebel in the infinite presence of a holy God....his grace is on you now as you read this...because you should be in hell as you read this. You are a rebel. You believe yourself to be higher than God, more important than God. This life isn't about you. God made you for his pleasure, not for yours. While that may offend you, the fact is and will remain...one day you will die, you will not be received blameless before a HOLY God, you will be guilty of lying, you will be guilty of stealing, guilty of Lust...and in all those you will be guilty of setting yourself up over God making yourself as God. The fact is Jesus said do not be afraid of him who can destroy your body...but be very afraid of him who can destroy your body and soul.

There is only one thing and one thing only that changes a person so that no matter what happens, they are always a Christian...and that is truly believing in Jesus Christ for their payment of their guilt of their sins and accepting him as a Holy God and repenting from your sinful ways...it may sound cliche, and it may nauseate you.....but I've been through worse than most of the spoiled brats in here for the cause of Christ and I've had my fair share of temper tantrums with God, but when you belong to HIM, you ever let go because HE SAID...I will NEVER LEAVE YOU, NOR FORSAKE YOU....a true believer can't escape from God and become an unbeliever because God has sealed that promise with his own blood covenant. Only someone who never believed can escape and become an unbeliever because they never had that promise from God and so therefore are perfectly able to run away from God. You are not his, you are of your father the devil....Good Daddies never disown there blood children....I know, mine is still with me and we've been through Hell on earth.

Scott

Thursday, October 28, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

BE AFRAID!

Everyone involved with this site and anyone reading it should be VERY carefull - don't mock God - life is not a joke - you are playing a very dangerous game - your soul is on the line - this site is a trick - think carefully - its in your hands.

Anonymous

Tuesday, October 26, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

Is there anything I can do?

Is there anything I can do?

The answer to the above question may well be "nothing", but I thought I might ask your opinion since you have "been there".

Let me explain. This is not a deconversion story, but I hope you don't mind me posting on this site.

I am deeply concerned about my ex boyfriend who has become involved with a charismatic church which seems to be taking over his life. He claims that he is not at all under their spell, that they are all extremely nice and normal people, that he is perfectly rational and just as put off as me by those "christian types". Yet he goes to prayer meetings and church services most days of the week, has admitted that he has recently begun talking in tongues, says that he is experiencing visits by the Holy Spirit, is preparing to be baptised to be born again, and marvels about the church leaders having the gift of revelation (they keep telling him that he is blessed by God, that he is destined to greater things, that his life will soon fall into place...). What's more he is now convinced that illnesses are demons that possess people and that prayer and exorcism has the power to heal. Well, to me this sounds like he has simply totally lost the plot and gone mad. But of course he just thinks that I just don' t want to see the truth and urges me to let God and Jesus into my life As it happens, I am quite happy with the state of my own spirituality, probably best described as agnostic. I cannot rule out that there is a God, but neither can I really believe it. I sometimes pray, but it's probably more a conversation I am having with myself. The point is that I feel no need to be saved and don't even find the prospect of an eternal afterlife particulary appealing. I enjoy this life as it is. But I am digressing, back to my ex boyfriend...

It is true that since he has "found God" he seems much more peaceful and at one with himself. Which in itself is of course great, but yet I cannot help but think that this whole thing is a disaster. You see, he is a lovely, honest person but he is unable to live in the real world. It would take me to long to explain all the ins and outs of his history and personality and our relationship, but suffice it to say that he has great difficulty in taking responsibility for anything in his life and finds it very difficult to take a decision of any kind. He is 39 years old and has been unemployed for years, always hatching great schemes about how to get rich quick which invariably all fail. For the last few years he has been living off the proceeds of the sale of a flat that his mother had bought for him some time ago, but this money is disappearing fast and he will have absolutely nothing left in a couple of years at the most. At this point I should probably say that he no longer lives here (that is London) He moved to Budapest about a year ago, basically to escape all the pressures he felt here (and that includes me) He went to Budapest because he knew some people there and started going to this Charismatic Church a couple of weeks after his arrival and well, he hasn't done much else since.

I know that he was and is lost, so in a way it is not a surprise to me that he has fallen for this Born Again Christianity stuff. I suppose it gives him great comfort because he doesn't have to deal with reality and because those people promise him the earth (or should that be "heaven"?) When I was with him, I tried very hard to encourage him to build a proper life for himself, but needless to say I didn't succeed. I know you can't change people, but do you think there is anything at all that I could do? It breaks my heart to see him sink further and further into this religious madness.

I'd be grateful for any replies and comments.

Kind regards

Georgia

P.S. Incidentally - he left me. He says that his relationship with God is all he needs and that a woman would just stand in his way of getting closer and closer to him. Can't compete with God, I suppose - thing is, people actually answer back to things. Real relationships are so much more of a challenge...

Friday, October 22, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

Stop meeting the creed and meet God

As I have browsed this site and read the 'testimonies' of the uncoverting people here...I notice several things. Most here believe Christianity is a set of rules or guidelines that you live by. Every group of people gathered has expectations of those within the gathering and to not adhere to those expectations means you are somewhat ousted from the group....except in "your" churches where you expected these people to accept you no matter how you presented yourself...people are people and they fail each other.

So here is what the truth really is about. Stop meeting the creed and meet God. It's about trusting IN JESUS not about what you can do for God.

Stop following people or churches and their dogma's. Jesus said take up your cross and follow me...not Tom, Dick, and Harry.

The Bible says you will be presented with the trial of your faith in order to prove to you, not God whether you really have trusted him and have been indwelt by the Holy Spirit. Sadly, most of you here know the answer to this question. You were never saved. That is why you didn't last. That is why you got offended and quit...a person who truly has the Spirit of God in them cannot quit....What is in him will not be overcome by anything in this world. Those who do not overcome the trials or at least get through them with there faith in god either stronger or more resolute...never had true faith in the first place.....because of the reason I stated before.

Here is the deal. 10 commandment show you and I are all guilty...everyone has lied, everyone has stolen, everyone has at some time lusted after that girl or guy that we wanted so bad. All have sinned. What churches are not teaching is that going to church, being baptised..it's all useless. You cannot fill a hole that goes on for eternity and that is the penalty for your sin. You have offended a pure, holy, infinite God. yeah, I know he is a God of love....but he is thrice HOLY....so his holiness outweighs his love 3 times. That's something else churches neglect. If I gave you a glass of water with a drop of sewage in it, it would turn your stomache and you'd be offended at me for even suggesting you drink it...yet you ask God to accept you with all your death from sin, into his holy eternity of life. Since the wages of sin is death, what can you do...you're dead. Dead men do not do anything...all that you do is null, void, vanity....God says even your works of righteousness are as filthy rags.

You are left with a question. You have tried church. You have tried putting Jesus on for this life and he failed you because things got tough, people didn't love you like they should have and life is just plain unfair. Join the club. Don't think I say this without my fair share of trials. In the last 6 years I have went through things that I couldn't imagine and are far worse than anything I've read on this site yet. But I am still a Christian because I didn't put Jesus on like suit for this life...I put Jesus on as a parachute for eternity...big difference in perspective.

Forget all this stuff about Jesus helping you with your marriage or your finances or whatever.....none of that applies to you until Jesus saves your soul from Hell.
The little banner over there talks about everyone being God's beloved creations and how could a good God send his beloved creations to Hell. Because he is HOLY and you are a rebel in the infinite presence of a holy God....his grace is on you now as you read this...because you should be in hell as you read this. You are a rebel. You believe yourself to be higher than God, more important than God. This life isn't about you. God made you for his pleasure, not for yours. While that may offend you, the fact is and will remain...one day you will die, you will not be received blameless before a HOLY God, you will be guilty of lying, you will be guilty of stealing, guilty of Lust...and in all those you will be guilty of setting yourself up over God making yourself as God. The fact is Jesus said do not be afraid of him who can destroy your body...but be very afraid of him who can destroy your body and soul.

There is only one thing and one thing only that changes a person so that no matter what happens, they are always a Christian...and that is truly believing in Jesus Christ for their payment of their guilt of their sins and accepting him as a Holy God and repenting from your sinful ways...it may sound cliche, and it may nauseate you.....but I've been through worse than most of the spoiled brats in here for the cause of Christ and I've had my fair share of temper tantrums with God, but when you belong to HIM, you ever let go because HE SAID...I will NEVER LEAVE YOU, NOR FORSAKE YOU....a true believer can't escape from God and become an unbeliever because God has sealed that promise with his own blood covenant. Only someone who never believed can escape and become an unbeliever because they never had that promise from God and so therefore are perfectly able to run away from God. You are not his, you are of your father the devil....Good Daddies never disown there blood children....I know, mine is still with me and we've been through Hell on earth.

Scott

Tuesday, October 05, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

SATAN IS ALWAYS ABOUT...

Satan is always about in everybody's lives. To see that he has confused so many people at one place is very disappointing. Satan's job in Christian’s lives is to confuse them so that they rethink their decision. I wish all of you would realize what Christ has done for you, died so that you may have life. I am not talking about a boring Sunday service. I am talking about an every day encounter with the God who made the world and you. I can definitely understand where many of you are coming from. Sometimes it feels, as what church teaches is not enough to keep you going. And I would agree it is not, most churches do not teach relationship, they teach religion. Religion is nothing, that is what the Pharisees had in the bible and Jesus did not get along with the Pharisees if you recall. That is all I have to tell you, but before I leave I have one warning for all of you. 1 John 2:19 “They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continues with us; but they went out that they might be made manifest, that non of them were of us.” Beware that your salvation was not authentic. If I were you I would give Jesus at least one more chance, since eternity in heaven or hell, is hanging the balance.

droopie1030@aol.com

Saturday, October 02, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

am i appalled, horrified, disgusted and threatened?

yo,

i am a Christian.

if i had to say i was any sort of Christian in particular, i would say im pentecostal, even though i attend a uniting church (i also happen to be an aussie)

am i appalled, horrified, disgusted and threatened? do i want to tie you up to a pole, cover you with gasoline and throw a match on you? do i feel any form of hatred towards you?

the answer is a resounding no!

(however, i am rather curious about the cross spinning around over the flames... it's making me dizzy looking at it...)

recent posts seem to be from catholics (which means that i automatically question the christian-ness of the person in the first place), or from people with wishy-washy spirituality, who didn't really connect with the whole christian thing. there are others, they just seem to be the ones that stick in my mind.

there are certainly many interesting ideas that have been put forward on this site. I would disagree with many of those ideas. I would agree with others.

there are a number of sad stories on this site. from my perspective, that is. the hurt, sadness, pain, wrong behaviour that they have experienced is quite simply, not nice, and, in some cases, blatantly wrong.

can i tell you why I am a christian? if you dont want to know, skip ahead to the next paragraph. i'm a christian because i am convinced that there is at least some form of deity, some kind of force behind the universe. i also believe that the situation that the world is in, is not the originally decided upon situation - there is evil in this world, and it has corrupted this world from its original state. I believe that the deity who created the world would want to restore it, because the way things are, we are unable to come before that deity-figure. I believe that Jesus came and did the dirty work of restoring, however, the final "victory over sin" (i cant think of another way of putting that, sorry) is yet to come (though it is imminent, since, well, it's all been done through Jesus).

you know, some people have claimed that they are now "empowered" because they've left "christianity" (im tempted to not call it christianity because of the fact that it's a world apart from where I am). i've been empowered by becoming a christian. i dont know where those people went to church, but personally, im encouraged to question and to think rationally. and i do - i have questioned my pastor on things he's said a number of times.

oh, hey, i just noticed that warning you have about keeping the Bible away from children due to its violence, obscenity and filth. isnt it great that it describes life in such a raw gritty, almost offensive way? i think so.

have a great day,

-timb.
mailto:timbond@canada-11.com

ps. - if you're wondering, -timb. is i guess my tag, im not trying to hide my real name from you. you may have noticed that it is in my email addy.

Monday, September 20, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

What is wrong with you people?

First off, what is wrong with you people? Why create a site to destroy the only thing that some people need to get them through the day. I admit, at times I believe that god does not exist, because I am only human, and ignorance is a very strong characteristic, but there has to be more out there besides us, a few other life forms, and a whole lotta space. God, is and should always be your refuge, even if its a cult. He's not asking u to make wallets, or screw lids on jam jars, he's just asking you to have a little faith. The apocalypse, is the inevitable end to this world, even if you like it or not. Because of our ignorance, we shall indeed destroy this earth, be it tomorrow, in a decade, or 200 milleniums. If god is real, his messiah shall return, and grant refuge to those whom have had faith in him, if not, we may all suffer because of our actions. Christianity promotes kindness to thy neighbor, and if everyone were Christian, we would never have to give up this world. Because of the actions of a few, (like you) this world is probably already given up. God may not, but the Devil walks among us, and he has already gotten to you, I am terribly sorry, but I deeply wish you would reconsider Christianity. I am a student from highschool, and I was athiest until I got to snooping, I realized that Christianity, gives us faith, and shows us what is meant for us afterlife, instead of just rotting in the ground.

Narindra Singh
trunks_64ca@hotmail.com


the devil has to win souls...

People escape from the Bible because its easier to do wrong. Some get mad because a prayer or 2 didnt get answered now they feel as if church is a waist. Worldly things have changed the minds of people what they see they believe and what they cant it must not be real. People of today think going to school is all you need. Thats why the world is the way it is today. Everything is so advanced but you have people scared to open their mail. You got people blowing themselves up. The world is becoming more dangerous than before thats becouse of the gap between God and the people if seperating daily. What sad is that someone will pay for the harsh words that are being said someones grandchildren will have to look back to see what went wrong in thier life and its not what he/she has done but what someone has done before them. Some the devil has so wrapped in his arms that this message is a joke for you. I just have to believe myself that the devil has to win souls as well and everyone isnt going to recieve Gods message. "and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time".1 John 2:18 " Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son".1 John 2:22 If you read this you have no excuse if you didnt you have heard it before may God have mercy on your soul!!!

Mr. C

Monday, September 06, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

Educate yourself about this aspect

I came to your site as a fluke however your site is only making fun of the religion and not educating people on how it doesnt make sence or whats wrong about it. Your points are not supported and anyone who read it would not be the least bit convinced at what you were saying. I dont believe in god in the least yet reading your site made me laugh- 14 year olds I know could make a better argument then you could. Horrible.

Christina

Saturday, September 04, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

You've been deceived!

Most of the testimonies on this website I've read were from people born in Christinity. Just because you were born into Christinity doesn't mean you are a Christian, most of the people were never actually Christians.

I've never understood why people could turn down the best religion in the world. Jesus died for us to save us from dying from our sins and all we have to do is accept this. You don't need to go to Church or "act" like a Christian just believe God is God and Jesus died for you to make your dirty heart clean and you can go to Heaven and live in a mansion and walk on street of gold forever, instead of burning in hell forever.

George

Sunday, August 22, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

No Jesus for You!!

Dave:

You have to read this article. You may want to link it to the website.

http://thecoaststar.com/weekly/2004/07.29.04/invalidate.html

Excerpt:
The First Holy Communion made by 8-year-old Haley Waldman in April
is considered invalid in the eyes of the Roman Catholic Church since the
Holy Eucharist she received did not contain any wheat.

HA HA! No wheat in the wafer means "No Jesus for You!!"



Catholics says the hosts must contain some wheat, which contains gluten..
Haley is allergic to wheat - so no Jesus for her?
Guess who made her allergic to wheat? God did that.

And since He made her allergic to your communion wafer - no Jesus for her?
What's wrong with you that you can't see that?



Question: Is her family's money still welcome in your collection basket?

Thursday, August 19, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

Floods from the Lord?

i'm in cornwall, i'm sure you've seen the news about the floods in boscastle,, the christians down here are having a field day because in boscastle there is a witchcraft musuem, i've never been there so i dont know if it promotes or just records and observes, but, as i say the christians are saying it was the lords revenge to get rid of this, does anyone else agree that if god is so threatened by one little building that destroying lives, houses and other property just sounds like he's throwing his toys out of the pram and having a paddy?


simon fake


Friday, August 13, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

Rude and Unprofessional

or Certainty vs Conviction

Although I am encouraged that there is a website such as this that has so much potential to support those of us departing a certain religion, I am equally discouraged that there is a high level of disrespectful, discourteous and even ignorant content and comment in this website.

Atheists, agnostics, etc all live by faith - a foundational belief that what they hold to is right and true. You may want to pretend this is not the case, but that doesn't change this fact. To ridicule, marginalize or in any other way castigate another person for their faith is wrong.

Many of us may have been deceived, misled, abused, or simply mindlessly following doctrines and leaders in organized religions, but for 95% of us who have departed from religion, we were not victims - we CHOSE to participate.

The same guilt-driven, threatening and condescending rhetoric is present in many of the dialogues and much of the content of this website that is found common among religious groups and sub-sects. Are we to return evil for evil? Is that the solution? It cannot be.

I challenge the webmaster, the subscribers of this site, and the leadership of exchristians.net to take a higher road. Mocking faiths of others is not morally, rationally or intellectually good or acceptable.

This bullshit of boohooing and bashing people of organized religions reminds me of third graders standing on the playground calling each other doo-doo heads.

The simple truth is that none of us, from atheists to Chrsitians to Moslems to existentialists, will know definatively WHAT the truth is - or what we should fear and not fear - until we are dead and stay dead.

In the meantime, those of us who are intellectually honest enough to admit that we, too, are living by a faith, need to discontinue our condescending theologies and behaviors and embrace tolerance, peace, respect, and honesty. Otherwise, we are no better than those we charge have wronged us.

Cliff Boston

Wednesday, July 28, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

No Such Thing

There is no such thing as an ex-Christian. If you thought you were a christian, and now you believe you are an ex-christian, you have missed the doctrine of Christianity. All you are is simply one who thought he was a Christian but now simply is still not a Christina. Being a Christian is not based on anything you do or don't do, not on who you are or were. In other words, you don't become a Christian by doing good deeds. There are probably many pastors/missionaries/teachers/etc who are going to Hell. God promises that He will be faithful to complete what He started. Read the Bible. You give yourself so much credit by claiming that you can become something on your own freewill or deny something that is sovereignly given to a person.

Jason

Thursday, July 01, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

Life without Jesus is meaningless

I came across your website this morning and found it very interesting.
I feel sorry for everyone on here who say they have had a bad experience with Christianity. but unfortunately all i have read on here is the testimonies of people who arent truely born again.

You see being brought up in a christian family doesn't make you a christian. In the same way Going to McDonalds does not make you a hamburger!

I was brought up in a non christian family and was Led to the lord by a friend and since then my life has totally changed!

The bible tells us that Jesus came to give life and life to the full and sice he entered my life he has given me all i could ever ask for. but most of all he has given me an assurance that one day i will be with him.

Life without Jesus is meaningless and i would encourage you all to really seek him. Because he loves you and died so you could be free

God Bless

Luke <><

Monday, June 28, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

You are treading on thin ice

I accidently came across your website and was amazed at the amount of time and effort put into such a sad conclusion. Imagine what you could do to help people with the time your spend on this. Although I'm sure your response is you are the one saving people from Jesus instead of Jesus saving them from darkness.

It saddens me deeply and all can do is pray that God will soften your heart and the hearts of those who are a part of this. Something painful must have happened to make all of you so hardened and angry. What ever that was, I'm sorry it affected you so strongly.

I am very well educated, open minded and thoughtful and I still know that the Jesus of the Bible is real. I grant you the fact that it can be confounding at times, but it makes perfect sense to human nature. Christianity is the only religion that deals with the way people actually are and not how they percieve themselves to be.

You are treading on thin ice and I hope you open your eyes and heart before it's too late. All your intellect won't save you from yourself.

God bless you on your journey.


Truthdefender7
email me

you sure do hate him

Wow! For someone who says he doesn't exist, you sure do hate him so. Why is he the focus of your life? Huh. I think I'd just leave him behind and move on.

He showed me a vision the other day. He and I were having a diet coke at a 50's diner. The overwhelming feeling I got was that he really was focused on me and wanted to be with me. At first, I was like, diet coke? That's not what Jesus would want me to drink; it causes cancer. Then, he said to me--that doesn't matter--only you and me matter.

Then, the other day when I was taking my daily walk, I had another impression. He confided in me. He was crying and said--"Why don't they believe I love them?" And I said, "It's ok. Don't be upset." Wow! I comforted him this time.

Don't blame him. Blame the false teachers of him. He's not a mean man in the sky. He wants to breathe into you life, and then give you a vision of who you were meant to be. Our tiny minds cannot fathom what brought us to this point from so many thousands of years ago. Breathe in peace not perfection, but be patient. This patience will produce character, and character produces hope, and this hope will never disappoint you.

I long to be a grassy field where you can lay your head, with fragrant daisies in the breeze encircling 'round your bed, where no one demands of you or expects you to perform. I long to be a grassy field--a place of love for you. My Jesus lie down to rest--my field is for thee. Let me carress your heart and fill your needs. You've given all to me. Now, let me give to you. Rest now my Jesus. I love you. Though others might be your ring or be a jewel inside your crown, I long to be a place of rest--a place of love for thee.

I really admire you for knowing how to do all this website stuff. That takes talent, man--or woman. How do you do those graphics?

Seth's Sister

Sunday, June 27, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

I made my decision

I made my decision a long time ago to worship the Lord Jesus Christ. I do not worship the Scriptures. I don't need them to be infallible to know that God is real.

Moreover, I do not look to the church for reasons for my faith. Church will always dissappoint!

L.

Saturday, June 26, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

Why do you try to un-convert the Christians?

Here is a question I would like to ask. Why do you try to un-convert the Christians?

First off, that makes us as bad as them. Christianity used the same sort of speeches to convert them in the first place. Second, let the people figure things out on their own like they should be able to do. That proves that they willed themselves to change faith and that WE are not being the inconsiderate ones.

Another thing is that Atheism is not technically better than Christianity. Different atheist sources just hate Christianity because that is what they were told to do growing up creating the same problem you had with Christianity.

Lastly, Converting everyone from Christianity will just make the masses create ANOTHER christianity of some sort. What people practice can change but people will always stay the same, creating new practices. Consider this please because it really makes sense to me.

MagnaCougar
MagnaCougar at yahoo.com

Sunday, June 20, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

Experiential Resonance

I read your testimony. I can't tell you how much you and I have in common with respect to our studying numerous books in order to get our questions answered. I started studying Christianity when I was very young with Dave Hunt and Hal Lindsey books. (I was just certain the rapture was going to happen in my lifetime. :) ) Then I moved into apologetics (I was a fierce "defender of the faith"). Then into Calvinism. The postmillenialism. Then preterism. Then this, then that. I studied church history, the languages, just everything I could get my hands on.

I really enjoyed reading your testimony of deconversion. It really resonates with my experience, too. Someday when I have the time I'll post my story.

Thanks for your site. It really helps me to not feel so lonely.

Jason M
Indianapolis, IN

Friday, May 28, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

WITCH

I was just reading an article someone sent me, how "Disney is Leading Children to Hell" (regarding a new kids show, W.I.T.C.H.) from the waaay fundie "World Net Daily" site. I was amused to find this little gem tucked away in the article. Thought you might appreciate the irony of it also...

The article also links to another site (also a hoot) that gives the "facts" about how bad the new show is to christians--

" Satan wants nothing more than for a person's life to be filled with things that appear to have meaning, but in the end have none and keep a person from tasting the truth. He tries to use a world filled with illusions and fantasies … to fill our lives with things that only deceive and bear no fruit."

it's so nice when they make our arguments for us!

Thursday, May 27, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

Dinosaurs in the Bible?

I'm just starting to look through your site, and so far, I'm pretty impressed. It looks like you have a lot of information and it's very professional in lay-out. This is to say, I have a lot of respect for you and your opinions (directly related to the presentation), and I believe that you have a lot of knowledge (more than me) when it comes to the (apparent) problems with Christianity.

I say apparent becuase I am indeed a Christian. I do have a huge distrust against the "organized" church, which is anything but. I don't attend church, except rarely, because I believe that much of what gets taught in church is a person's (pastor, etc) own beliefs or retoric or whatnot.

I don't know how much energy you now put into this site, but I thought it would be interesting to begin a conversation of sorts with you, if you would be interested. Having grown up within the church and now being a bit outside of it, I have always heard of problems with the Bible and with Christianity, but I haven't yet had an opportunity to seriously consider what they are. I believe that in order to be a "true" Christian, I must approach my beliefs and faith from a realistic point of view. I do not believe that blind faith is for everyone. Perhaps that might work for some people (there are different backgrounds, cultures, levels of intelligence), but I would like to seriously consider what I have been taught (I don't believe everything a pastor has told me), again, in a realistic and objective manner.

I took your Bible quiz--actually had fun and it made me laugh. I will not respond to all the questions, because, well...if you would like, I can respond. However, I do have a question/thought. More than one person (Sunday-school type setting) told me that the following verses referred to dinosaurs, and that the footnotes were not correct. Truth be told, they do make more sense as dinosaurs, I believe. I won't quote, but: Job 40:15 (brontosaurus, now apatosaurus) and Job 41:1 (though I can't remember which--my elementary knowledge of dinosaurus has greatly diminished).

Please let me know what you think. I'll continue to go through your website. I look forward to hearing from you.

Amber
van_essa64 at yahoo.com

Tuesday, May 25, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

Stephen Maguire - nut case.

Stephen Maguire wrote: Believe this YOU WILL DIE SOMEDAY AND YOU CAN'T STOP IT, rationalize that if you can, give me your arguments !!!! YOUR GOING INTO THE GROUND AND THATS THE END, IF YOU HAVE HALF A BRAIN YOU KNOW THATS NOT TRUE.
You mean to say all our loved ones we won't see again, PULL THE OTHER ONE THERE BELLS ON IT !!! :-)

Stephen Maguire wrote: Hey all you good people your webmaster in his wisdom has blocked me again so can some of you remind those in the EX JW POSTING THAT I HAVEN'T RUN AWAY BUT IN TRUTH THE WEBMASTER HAS BLOCKED ME, MAYBE I HIT A NERVE.
He knows i'm a treat to his lies and deceit,and that not all of you but some are in league with the devil, and are pretending to not believe in God, so don't be fooled by him, LONG RUN THE FOX, until it is eventually caught, like Sadam down a spider hole.
No offence Sadam just an anology.
BYEEEEE !!!

stephen Maguire wrote: Hi Dave just dropped in to see how you were doing, not very clever of you blocking me, if you hadn't done that I would have been gone long ago but now it's personal.

Anyway still selling your corrupt tee-shirts on the web, making loads of money out of ex-christian ???

Your as bad as those corrupt preachers, hows Mandylibra keeping, sorry you suffered so much in your life, I have too but have to get on with it, the only comfort I had when growing up was looking at the King of suffering, and thats why Jesus said that no servant is greater than the master,if the master suffered,then we aren't going to escape it, don't worry I HOPE YOU SEE YOUR UNBORN CHILD AGAIN, OH YES GOD HAS TAKEN CARE OF THOSE UNBORN CHILDREN AS WELL, NOTHING IS IMPOSSIBLE FOR GOD.
I will pray for you and if you like you can e-mail me personally, it's up to you.
Anyway Dave Van the man, nice to speak to you again, sorry people if I DON'T reply to you, but Dave has decided to block me, but I ALWAYS GET THROUGH, he only wants you to hear what what pleases him, thats paramount to Communism, oh well some things never change.

God BLESS you all I shall pray for you

Stephen Maguire wrote: Not a chance of Christanity dying out, we have the word of Jesus on that one, "PETER UPON THIS ROCK I SHALL BUILD MY CHURCH AND THE GATES OF HELL SHALL NOT PREVAIL AGAINST IT"

Hey webby still unable to block me, I don't know you are losing it,inspite of me trying to help you out here letting you know i'm on a proxy server.

Oh !!! well just when you thought it was safe to switch on your computer, here comes Stevie boy !!!!

This is fun I like this website, bye Dave you good old ex-Chritian you, have a nice day.
Oh I was thinking of hacking your website and shutting you down, but unlike you I believe in freedom of speech, so decided against it.
Ok bye my good buddies.
Stephen ;)

I'm sure you are wonderful people.... BUT!

While I completely support your freedom to choose your own path in life, express yourself and your views how you see fit, etc. It's rather profound the amount of hypocricy I have come across just browsing this particular site. There is alot of talk about the extreme persecution and lack of tolerance christians have inflicted on others. Do you yourselves not show a lack of tolerance? Do you yourseleves not persecute christians, catholics, etc. when you hold a standard that you are unable to meet? Not all people who hold religion at the center of their lives are out for world domination, commit mass murders, or out to force themseleves on others. Christians and catholics alike have some disreputable individuals in their history. There are alot pagans who have done some pretty awful things. Does that make all pagans abhorable and likely to do the same? Absolutely not! Should they all be lumped together and labled? Absolutely not! There are some pretty amazing pagans out there that as a christian, I am proud to call my friends. We respect each other, don't judge each other for our predecessors shortcomings, and above all accept each other beliefs and all. For some, it is what works for them. Just as being pagan, atheistic, or agnostic works for others. By the way catholocism and christianity are two seperate religions with different systems of beliefs. If you choose to continue to be judgemental, they should be judged seperatley according to the customs they bring forth. Lumping them together would be like saying an atheist and an agnostic are the same. Which by definition would not be an accurate assessment. Again, this is not an attack against your beliefs or you as individuals. I'm sure you are wonderful people. Just be careful that the fingers you point can't be turned around and pointed back at you.

askboutwell@hotmail.com

Wednesday, May 12, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

My wife is now a christian

My wife is now becoming a Christian and I am very bothered by it. Any sugesstions to help me through this trying time?

Disco Stu

Friday, April 23, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

Leave no man behind

I have been reading through your website off and on during the last few months now - it's a fascinating place. I have a question you may wish to put to your forum. It is one specifically for those who seriously question the very foundation of Christianity. Before I ask, a brief synopsis;

Philosophers from Kant to Wittgenstein, Descartes to Russell, have all added their perspectives of religion, some damning others less so. There is a distinctive line in modern philosophy of religion between those who outwardly denounce the plausibility of Christianity or deities at all, and those who occupy themselves with defining the thought processes that lead to this type of conclusion rather than actually concluding.

Although not a philosopher, Thomas Paine's literary brilliance culminated in The Age of Reason - a truly masterful piece of writing and argumentation - in which he repeatedly states his respect for those whose opinion may differ from his (a not too surprising fact coming from the man who gave us the basis for the UN Declaration of Human Rights). But not unlike Bertrand Russell I feel, Paine also frequently flirts with the idea that we ought to fight the farce that is Christianity. In some instances he is quite belligerent (passionate?) in his rebuke of those choosing to emurse themselves in this "wretched scam".

Herein lies the dilemma: as people who believe that Christianity is at the very most a temporal contortion of pagan tradition and political happenstance, responsible for some of the worst atrcocities in man's histoy, is there not a concomitant moral/ humanist obligation to "de-convert" Christians we come into contact with?

Your site is designed to encourage and help exChristians to move on and build their lives without the religious crutch. But what about those left behind? Does the Humanist movement need to adopt a policy of engagement? And if so, what would be the nature of its approach and from where would it derive its ultimate legitimacy? I find these the most pressing and frustrating questions.

I thought I would throw it out there and see what thoughts come back.

Thanks

Wayne

Friday, April 16, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

Hey Preacher, Leave those kids alone!

Joel Atkinson

I have a right to write this.

You see, I am an insider...an eye-witness. Critics will say that this is an attack and they will be found correct. For that is precisely what it is. However, it is also a defense. It is indeed both of these things, and, frankly speaking, I do not see a way that the two can be separate, at least not in this instance. Any attack is in truth the most aggressive defense of something very important to you. So let the critics try and try to separate the two. In these writings, at least, the two will be one and the same. An attack on the so-called Church of Christ and a defense of the so-called Lost in the world, for whom the Church of Christ constantly seeks their conversion or destruction, whichever comes first.

Let them lie and say they do not seek this. If this is truly what they are saying, then they disavow the very sacred and most perfect book they claim to obey. For throughout that book, the writers instill in the readers a duty, nay, a need to convert everyone and anyone to their way. Furthermore, throughout their book one can constantly find the theme of destruction of all who oppose them and their god, or is it gods, they can't ever seem to agree on that one, can they? So, you see, any christian in this world who even half-ass follows the book is either wishing for your conversion or your death and eternal roasting in the bowels of the great hellacious barbecue pit, manned by Chef Lucifer himself, that wicked little devil who taught us how to read. How to...disobey. For that would be a terrible thing for a people to do, wouldn't it, governments of the world?

Large corporations and church-armies? To...disobey. To...revolt. To...rise up and take the life that is ours by right. Of birth. Of breath. Of fire and wind and all that is truly sacred in this real world, the only world we have, not the fucking heavenly one. This world, dammit. Face it or leave it, but do one or the other and cease your efforts to make miserable all of those who choose to be a man or a woman and stand up to it, facing its horror and beauty alike. Let's be honest here, we'd go for a rapturish abduction of you guys. Sure. We want you gone, anyway. We're sick and tired of your damnable lie and your filthy, slutty book.

Jesus talked about living and all you can do is focus on his death. It is a disgrace to his name the way you wear it on your fucking t-shirts and dare to tell the hurting and the lame that that exact same name loves them. Why should they care if he loves them? He's dead. Your kind killed him, not the jews or the romans, but narrow-minded bigots full of hatred. The question is, do you love them? You see, you're actually living. Breathing. You know, the usual things we equate with life. So, do YOU love them, with or without a god to hide behind? If Jesus walked this earth today I believe the church as a whole would kill him quick as they would Osama Bin Laden himself. You're all full of shit and we all know it so get over it and move on.

If you love the man so much then do what the fucking hell he said do and don't judge, don't fear, love your neighbor, actually become like a child again instead of praying a stupid-ass little prayer and then pretending like something great and wonderful happened. Santa Claus doesn't bring presents to little poor kids so grow up. You want to do something then fucking do it, whether it be feed the hungry without feeding them your selfrighteous vomit or getting it over with and waging actual war on all unbelievers, not just the muslims. What a stupid, stupid part of our populace. We've got a freakin religious fanatic in control of our country and you step out on the limb and predict a coming apocalypse. Fucking duh! Have you ever heard of the idea of enacting the stories you read? Especially when you believe those stories are absolute divine truth.

Hello! Is any of this sinking in? You guys are the ones who are going to bring about the apocalypse, because you believe in that story so much it is inevitable that you will make it happen, at least the world getting blown all to shit part. I'm afraid that the heaven and hell part and all of that bullshit just are not gonna happen, as you'll soon see immediately following your precious apocalypse. When the earth dies because everybody's tossing nuclear bombs around like so many baseballs, we'll all soon see that if we ever had a soul, then it was surely somehow connected to the earth and the universe around us, within us.

But we always separated ourselves from it, and you guys have always been so fast to assassinate the character of anyone who dares love a tree or see god in the butterfly as well as the cross. Did you even read the gospels, people? You know it was the most religious people who killed your king? The most unbending, unflexible people. They're the ones who crucified your godforsaken savior. If you remember the stories, the Lost ones were his friends. And my case is closed, Mr. McDowell.

My Evidence that demands a verdict is his church and their horrible, hateful, evil book. And people like you.

Saturday, April 10, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

A LIE

I was never a Christian. My father was raised Catholic and my mom Baptist. They got married in a Methodist church and I went to a Lutheran congregation a few times as a child. Even as young as 4, the atmosphere bothered me; The abstract sermons, the rudeness of some children during youth group. The tight dress clothes seemed out of place, why dress up to find out what makes us human?

I asked my mother if I could stop going when I was ab out 5, because it was boring and I just had an odd feeling about it. The only other time I went into a church was a week-long Bible study at the same chruch building when I was probably 9. The arts and crafts annoyed me and seemed like busy work. I couldn't grasp the attitudes of the other children. I dropped out after 2 days. My brother conintued to attend, and I got phone calls, postcards and letters from the Pastor for 4 months afterwards. I got very angry at him for not leaving me alone.

I never professed Jesus, and always had an interest in biology, even at 6. I was the classic 80's dinosaur toddler, spouting out names and figures. In ther beginningof high-school I "became" Pagan and started expressing openly my probloems with Christianity. I later realized I didn't believe in any of those God(desses) either and just became my own personal mix of atheist-agnostic, not really knowing but feeling there wasn't a deity. I didn't care, I would be judged based on all the things I did here, which were comprised of a lot of volunteer work.

To top it off I was never a Chistian,I just love reading this site and wanted to espouse the great

Buddy
email: work.otaku_faith at @yahoo.com

Saturday, April 03, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

Why can't we Think?

Due to problems with the server, this is the only way I could get a comment in. First, let me say that I am and as far as I can tell always will be a follower of Jesus. I dislike the lable "Christian" because of the stigmas most people in my culture attach to it. In addition to being a Jesus-follower, I am also an adherant of the Gothic subculture, a subculture that does not smile on blind faith.

I just wanted to thank the webmaster for his stunning commentary on the lack of intellectual life in the Christian community. Only among Goths, thier sympathizers, a few select Bible college professors have I found total acceptance for my somewhat unorthodox approach and my insistance on good, logical reasons to back beliefs. I may disagree with your conclusions, Dave, but I totally understand the thought process that led you to them. You and your work have as much if my full support as I can give without denying the things I myself believe.

-Melanie Fellion, 24, Student.
website

Tuesday, March 30, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

Okay - I have NO idea!

My dear brother in Jessus Christ, With this ocasion of Jessus Christ I said to your family with : 1 Corinteni 15.20 „But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept and 1 Corinteni 5.7 For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us, The Lord Jessus bless you all the time with the happy for Ps 41.1-3 Blessed is he that considereth the poor: the LORD will deliver him in time of trouble.2 The LORD will preserve him, and keep him alive; and he shall be blessed upon the earth: and thou wilt not deliver him unto the will of his enemies. 3 The LORD will strengthen him upon the bed of languishing: thou wilt make all his bed in his sickness. I am a brother in Christ. My name is Nica Adrian .I have nine little children [The bigger is school –bag(18 years old) and the younger is 3 years old]. My message sent you is real, I say the truth in Christ, I lie not ,my family have great need of help the Lord Jesus given per your, because I must to pay the rates which are at present of 260 $ approximately and I now J has big debt. approximately 35 $, my wife on credit buy food..I.please very much if you want and you vex help my family flax manner point-blank . My address is: Nica Adrian, street Marasesti, nr.288, Bloc:163F, Ap:3, Ploiesti, Jud.: Prahova, Romania, Europe. Telephone number: 0244/557361 ,email adriannica2001@yahoo.co.uk, because I am in a very difficult situation because I have nine children to can pay the taxes for my flat I beg you in the move of I Christ if you want and if Jesus put on your heart to give me a help for the aprox. 260 $ because where J work that surveyor and my salary where is 3900000 lei(prox .90 $ /month) and J can’t pay these money and not be judge in the law and give out from my house with nine children. We live in a flat( 4 rooms-on the ground floor and the price of the rates is approximately 40-50 $ summer/month and approximately 130 $ winter/month). It is very hard to pay the rates which are at present of 260 $ approximately. J wrote this things hoping that you can that you help us my poor family, to make us a joy from my J have 6 children in the school.Now J has big debt. Approximately 35 $ my wife on credit buy food..J beg you to give me a help for the aprox. 260 $ and J can’t pay these money and not be judge in the law and give out from my house with nine children J asked for you this help please. I must have payment 4 taxes per 4 month(nov., dec. 2003+ jan. feb. 2004) at my flat since prox.(8479380 lei/32250lei=one dolar)=260 $, and I have big need by the help payment this taxes in continuance.,the major need for my family are payment liabilities and the the food and I have big need by the help payment this taxes My message is real, I say the truth in Christ, I lie not, therefore I please very much in Name of Jesus Christ, you want, The LORD put in your heart ,you put one good word that is write in Geneza 40.14 But think on me when it shall be well with thee, and shew kindness, I pray thee, unto me, and make mention of me unto … your pastor,your church, if they want,can,a collection for my family that I can pay this liabilities, beyond whereby is write in 1 Corinteni 16.1-2 Now concerning the collection for the saints, as I have given order to the churches of Galatia, even so do ye..Upon the first day of the week let every one of you lay by him in store, as God hath prospered him, that there be no gatherings when I come., if you are poor in order that my family,I want not abuse for you,I am obliged,thankful for all you make for my family , J am sorry J write to you but J desire you to give me a good announce. Proverbe 25.25 As cold waters to a thirsty soul, so is good news from a far country. At we, in Romania if I pay not this sustenances consecutive ( the cost input of : water cold and the water warm, the fart, the energy electric and the energy thermal, the heat in my flat(4 rooms) where I live Consecutive, pursuant to the laws in force, The executive make summons and I payment not I am call The magistrate, to take out(to elicit) my house to bidder and The magistrate to evacuate my family since my house I am in a danger situation and if I pay not this sustenances are possible to close water( cold and the warm )supply, to close filling he energy electric and the energy thermal, to close(vulg.)fart etc. I please very much, in the Name of Jesus Christ, if you want, you can, you not vex,Thr Lord Jesss put your heart to help my family with little help/monthly in manner point-blank or in manner indirect you put one word good for my family at who want help my family)., My message sent you is real, I say the truth in Christ, I lie not my family have great need of help the Lord Jesus given per your God make you an arrow for win for me and my family.J thank you for understanding. I write in idea than them prayers make we and The Lord Jesus per we than is write in :”Withhold not good from them to whom it is due, when it is in the power of thy hand to do it.”Prov.3.27, “For I delivered the afficted that cried”Job 29.12, “distributing to the necessities of the saints.” Rom.12.13,but let us not lose heart in doing good; for in due time,if we do not faint,we shall reap. So then, aswe have occasion, let us do good towards all, and specially towards those of the household of faith. Gal.6.9-10, from it love for Jesus. But I beseech you ,brethren,,bear the word of exhortation Hebrews 13.22 I please very much you want,you would found the sponsor for my family and if you can give a joy for my 9 childrens of the Easter day. The Lord to help at this problem.I heaven forgiveness if I angry with you per this letter. Thank you for understanding. The Lord bless your family all the time . With all my love, Nica Adrian The lord Jesus help you you that you are that Iosif one man vestal Mat 1.19: Then Joseph her husband, being a just man, and not willing to make her a publick example, was minded to put her away privilyAnd Prov 11.13 A talebearer revealeth secrets: but he that is of a faithful spirit concealeth the matter,andI please very much that you consider at me beggar. I and my wife are sick, we need the money for treatment, remedy;medicament; for treatment teeth etc. my email adriannica2001@yahoo.co.uk

Saturday, March 27, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

our addictions were killing us separately

Hello. I have been reading the material on this site now for about a week. And I think it's fascinating. You sir, know your stuff, as far as I can tell. You have obviously searched high and low. And somehow... until a few years ago, I was married to a fundamentalist Christian. And at the time I myself was an active drug addict, so you can imagine the fireworks that sometimes went off in our house.

I had lived in England for eight years and had had much difficulty with heroin while living there. I did what many addicts do, what's called a "geographical,” and moved back to America. I tried to straighten up and fly right. I stopped using, I got a real job (I’m a musician), and I got married. She was the prettiest girl I’d ever seen. She was obviously troubled by a lot of things, but then again, so was I.

She wasn't Christian then. We were dating and sleeping together. One day I went to work, and by the time I came home, she had gotten a bible out, and prayed to Jesus to come into her heart (I’m sure you know the drill), and become saved. She was constantly going on about it. And she wouldn't sleep with me anymore unless and until we got married. I didn't like the Christian thing one bit.

It seemed fearful and punitive. It just couldn't be right. But she was immovable. And I loved her. And I couldn't see any reason not to marry the woman I loved just because she loved Jesus. I married her. The story of our relationship is long and kind of ugly. But let's just say that there were a lot of disagreements. Along the way, I got saved too, because I wanted to do right by her, and she and her friends were VERY persuasive, and I had started to be harassed by thoughts that regardless of MY reservations, THEY might be right.

For a while, I found some relief from myself. But nothing really changed. I had no spirituality really, and no tools for living. And I was still just as damaged and unhappy as I had ever been. Maybe more so. I certainly found nothing but a lot of unhealthy hypocrisy and dysfunction in the churches I went to. I really needed and wanted some meaning in my life.

But after a sustained attempt to believe, I still felt like all the Christians I knew were just a bit simple minded and fooling themselves, to be blunt. Then one day I met a dealer. A drug dealer that is. I got high, and once again, I was "fixed." It got bad quickly. My wife was praying and witnessing to me, but I could tell that her friends thought I was just a filthy drug addict. And she began to feel that way too. I felt that she was delusional. And that religion wasn't helping her or me; it was making us more unhappy.

I know it wasn't ONLY my drug addiction, because she was unhappy BEFORE that. Basically, our addictions were killing us separately. But mine was much, much faster. And I was DOING SOMETHING ABOUT MINE. Everyone at church loves a good, pretty Christian girl and NO ONE loves a junkie. But I was checking into rehabs, and going to AA meetings and really trying. She didn't find any of that necessary. And she had a support system for her pathology.

I was on my own. One night, after a relapse, I went to her and said that I really wanted to find a way to make our relationship work. I asked her what we could do. I was at my wit's end. Out of ideas. And quite honestly, I needed for us to connect, person to person, love each other as humans, and find a solution together. I had never been more vulnerable in my life. She turned to me, and with a look of absolute rage, she said, "what the fuck do you care?" And that was it. I threw her out.

And the day she left, I embarked on the scariest drug journey that I had ever taken. There was no wife, no job, and no hope. I was shooting heroin and cocaine every 30 minutes, 24 hours a day, seven days a week, for five months. In the end I was skinny, shot out, bloody, dirty, sweaty and crazy. DYING. In my madness I found myself staring at a ringing phone, unable to answer it, because I was convinced that it was Jesus calling to rebuke me. Then, I overdosed. For the LAST time.

I was found in my car, in a parking lot, and taken to the hospital, where I was revived. And I took a look at what I had become. A pathetic loser. And I realized that I would have to take action, real action, to turn my life around, and keep it going that way. And that NOTHING FROM OUTSIDE ME WOULD EVER EVER SOLVE MY PROBLEM WITH ME. That was almost five years ago.

And I must say that I am NOT an atheist. Nor do I subscribe to any religion. But through action-- I have discovered that there IS some force or some kind of intelligence that somehow helps me. It is much much too elusive to describe, and it wants nothing from me, other than to ask it for help, and to help others in small ways. In my view, you are doing the same.

I guess I find what one might call god in the "somehow.” "My life was a catastrophe and then somehow..." it surely is a mystery. And NO preacher, imam, rabbi, guru, or whatever, could ever give it to me. I’m still on my own in that regard. And I wouldn't have it any other way. COURAGE TO FACE MY OWN FLAWED SELF WITHOUT TAKING THE EASY WAY OUT.

I still speak to my ex-wife occasionally. She’s drinking, dating pathological assholes, and trying to find her way. She’s modified her beliefs, but she's still a Christian. She’s got Jesus, and I’ve got my "somehow." The difference is, that I am comfortable in my own skin. She’s not. It’s kind of sad. Thanks for reading me.

Andrew
thingmail at aol.com

(THING™ the most mesmerizing rock group on this planet.) Sorry, I HAD to plug the band, part of the new me.

Thursday, March 25, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

The Bible says...

I want you to know that no matter how much you've spoken out against God and his word, he loves you more than you'll ever be able to comprehend.

The Bible says you were fearfully and wonderfully made, and that neither angel nor demon can separate you from the love of God.

Please understand that the church has rarely gotten things right, man has rarely ever reflected the glory of God, but Jesus will never, ever, lead you astray.

If you're so confident in your disbelief, then I issue you a challenge: ask God to reveal himself to you if he's real. If you're right, then nothing happens, and you have nothing to worry about.

Some of the most powerful men of God in the Bible were those that fell the hardest at first.

I promise you that a life lived for the Lord is far more fulfilling and wonderful than any junk this world will ever offer you.

Just look at how the world is falling apart at the very seams.

The Lord never changes, and his love for you never fails. There's never any shame in coming to him for forgiveness, and he'll wait for you throughout all of your days.

Take it from an Ex-Agnostic.

Brandon emodolphins@yahoo.com

Wednesday, March 24, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

What's Your Label?

Is your label Christian, Muslim, Jew, Hebrew, Baptist, lawyer, Indian chief, catholic, preacher, priest, pope, drunk, etc, pick one or make one up. All labels are self-claimed. When you come out of your mothers womb there's not any sticker or label or stamp on your body to label you, Just because your mother claims to be Jewish, or Muslim, or whatever does not mean that you're this famous claim that you have taken on yourself.

I claim to be a human citizen of the planet earth. I have no label as a person that was put here by no cause of my own. We were all born not because of some God having planned each of us for millions of years, as religious bigots will have you to believe. We (all of us) were put here simply because your father in the heat of passion and lust for your mother, could not, or would not abstain from inseminating your mother. It's as simple as that.

All labels and titles are self claimed only, there are no credentials. We have learned, that by being prejudice gives us a right to hate other people, that also had no say as to being born on this planet. This behavior is learned, it's not natural, we learn this early on in our childhood from our parents, from our schools, from our churches.

prejudice is hatred for others not like us and we are all prejudice and until the people of this planet understand this we will continue to kill others in the name of a God.

If there is a God I'm sure God would be mighty ashamed of how people
use religion and self-claimed labels to hate and manipulate masses of ignorant humans.


Larry Jones
VA

Sunday, March 21, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

An Ex-Christian is non-existent

Hello.

Is God truly the answer? Yes. God created us, brought us here, and allows us to crucify him all over again every time we hurt him.

This site gives me pain. It hurts to see non-Christians, but it truly pains me to see people who have turned from the greatest thing that has ever happened to me.

An Ex-Christian is non-existent. Once you have invited Christ into your life, He will "not leave you or forsake you."

You are going to Heaven. However, if you have the audacity or bitterness to leave, I believe that you were never a Christian in the first place.

If you truly were saved by the grace of God, then you would realize that learning of His mercy and grace, and being with Him forever was so addictive that you would never get enough.

I can only pray that you will be changed by this message.

-Chris, God Follower
swat_man_mp5@hotmail.com



Romans 1:16
I am not ashamed of the Gospel, for it is the power of God for salvation to everyone who believes.

Thursday, March 18, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

deception

Hello,

I just want to tell you what a blessing it is to serve our Lord Jesus Christ.

I see so hate on this website. There are Hypocrites in all walks of life. That does not make truth a hypocrite. I was angry at God. I wanted to know the truth of things. So I had a open mind about Christianity.

It is so historcally accurate. If somebody wants to correspond with me, I could go in detail. Our on selves blind us from the truth because it requries a effort of faith. Let
me just say this chaos is opposite of perfect organazition.

Well may you search for truth with a open mind and May His grace bless you.

Matt Mosteller

Tuesday, March 16, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

Tired of the Myth

There is no talking snake. The earth is not 6000 years old. Angels are not keeping us safe. No one can be good enough to be Christ like. Even Peter lied about know God when the Romans came for him.

Non Christians should not try to imposed their ideas on Christian as Christians feel threatened. The only thing they can say id God loves you and get saved or go to HELL. I can't pretend to Christian. I don't like to be around superstitious people; I don't even have a rabbit's foot.

Some Christians in their own time will face reality but most most need the drug. They can be high on God and still get a job and drive a car so it may be better than crack. I don't want to change them the more people who think they will be tormented by a loving God are potentially dangerous and I don't want to piss of that crowd of loons.

John Evers
jevers at triad.rr.com


Became a Christian: 12 or so
Ceased being a Christian: 50
Labels before: Baptist /Lutheran Was ordain but gave up on the idea
Labels now: Deist in doubt
Why I joined: Fear of hell and death. Mostly pure ignorance, 112 id ignorant enough
Why I left: I did years of research and found religion is a neurological diorger based on mythology

Saturday, March 13, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

The Man from Neverwas

When you can't honestly say you've been part of something, it becomes a lot easier to leave it behind.

I had always been part of a family that, by all accounts, you could call "Chrisitan". My grandmother was probably the most religious of us all, at least for as long as I could remember. My own life had been what those so inclined could call a "miracle": I was three months premature, asthamtic, and would probably have died without a little luck... or a lot. Thus, the idea was firmly implanted in everyone's head: I must have been a miracle, end of story.

All through my life, I had been the type who questioned things. Among them, I wondered why a supposedly benevolent god would let bad things happen to those who didn't deserve it, while the horrible people of the world wallowed in ill-gotten wealth, power, and control. It's really hard to pinpoint where the change began, since I'm sure I started to question it somewhere around 12 or 13.

When 9/11 came, I saw what I feared most: religion, something I wasn't particularly fond of overall, taken to an extreme that caused people to be hurt. That was about the time that I officially renounced my faith, although I didn't really have much of anything to renounce.

It all would be going fine, if not for the fact that my mother had a breakdown last year and started to attend a fundamentalist church, with which I have serious conflicts of interest. Because of the beliefs they've instilled in her, I'm afraid to even declare my own opinion.

I see religion, and especially Christianity, as a bomb painted to look like a flower - it looks harmless, unless you know about what lies under the surface. Justifying, and legislating, hate through duress, as the neo-conservatives here do, is something that was never supposed to happen. But, until the day that we apostates are not seen as "Godless heathens" trying to "destroy religion and take God out of the country", we will always be the second-class citizens that nobody in power will stand up for.

Vulgaris Prime

THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS AN EX-CHRISTIAN!!!

Jesus isn't just some belief we put faith into. He was real, and in the flesh. You, never accepting him or learning from the Bible who he was, doesn't mean you once did accept Him.

In order to be an ex at anything, you must first have accepted Him and ALL His Glory. So you read one or two stories and tried to compare it to your life or whatever. Have you seen the PASSION yet? Or is it to much to bear that you won't go see it.

The movie came at the perfect time!!! With gay marriages happening in our country, this movie is a wake up call for all humanity. Even the fake believers who now claim they are ex Christians. You never believed in the first place.

I see all these pawned off ideas on here and it reminds of Liberals and Utopianism. And we all know what quacks they are. Man uses only 10% of their brain, and in this websites case, we'll say 2%,(and that is stretching it).

Well, if God just couldn't make it any easier for you, he allowed the movie "The PASSION", which is PURE TRUTH, not idealogical theories of crap you display on your washed up website. YOU NEVER BELIEVED TO BEGIN WITH, THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS AN ex-CHRISTIAN.

City: Houston
State: Tx
Country: USA
Became a Christian: old enough to realize man is blind
Ceased being a Christian: Ceased what?? I love the Lord thy God
Labels before: Don't need labels or churches, I have Jesus.
Labels now: Oh you people pride yourself in labels. I label you blind.
Why I joined: The Bible's awesome power of TRUTH led me.
Why I left: I didn't you 10 % usagers of brains.

LT

Saturday, February 28, 2004                                                                                       View Comments

we want to believe in a God...

What man can represent a God, or any God? Funny how people can claim they're called by God to preach? Yet they are very willing to accept money for their services.

If i were to be called by supposedly the most powerful being in the universe, it would be such a great honor for some God to have picked me, of all people in the world he could have chosen, that no monetary reward would ever sufice the great feeling of singlearity, from whom picked me to represent a God almighty. Why would a God call anyone to represent for God?

Also funny how God can call people to scam them out of their money, but cant help a 11 year old girl from being raped and killed in Florida, while her kidnapping was being video taped and recorded by humans.

Funny how come God just calls certain people for his own agenda. Why do we let these scoundrels fool us into believing them? Could it be that we want to believe in a God and a heaven so much that we are willing to give up our common sense in order to believe in the unbelievable.

It's the fear of the unknown, we fear death. It's the unnecessary fear of the unknown of after death that created all religions. We need a savior to help us through the journey of death, we need comfort, a reward, a feel good feeling to comfort us.

Church also comforts us, and the like minded members support us in our insanity of believing the unbelievable. God exists only in the minds of people, after death there is no more thinking. No more thinking of God and religion. After death there is no more
of anything.

Larry James

Wow,

Not sure what to think about this one.

Here I am, surfing the web, checking out blogs and boom - ExChristian.net. And what do you know - I am a Christian.

I have read a lot of the articles on your site. Some of which raise some valid questions and some of which are filled with as much nonsense as you claim Christianity contains. I think you would freely admit that. Anyway, I have read your entire testimony and wanted to comment. You mentioned that Christians blame your rejection of Christ on the poor treatment and bad example of other believers. I agree with you that such an assessment misses the mark.

I think the reason you became frustrated and felt a need to step away in the first place was that not one of the "churches" you described seemed to be a true church. I am not saying that everyone in those churches were faking it (though you might say the must have been if it is all really a lie). I am saying that the things you experienced from those churches were abhorrent. It was either a false religion based on emotionalism and feeling, or legalistic nonsense calling itself Reformed. I don't doubt your knowledge and have read many of the same authors. I also believe that if I am going to call something truth that I should be able to defend it not only with my heart but also with my mind.

That said, I think it is important to read and study the other viewpoints that exist and really investigate the claims of those views. In the added comments, it is obvious that you have further made up your mind that Christianity is bunk. That doesn't negate the fact of what you experienced during the time you were involved in the church. I do not know your heart. But I also believe that we can look at each other’s lives and make statements based on what we see.

So here are a few things I wonder about your journey: When you accepted Christ at that movie, did you really understand that you were a sinner in need of a savior, or was it the fear of hell of the emotion of the movie that truly griped you? When the leaders and Pastors around you could not answer your questions, did you look harder for those who could? You mentioned you have read Sproul. I don't think there is a question you could asked him (when you were still looking for answers) that he could not answer not only with the Scriptures, but philosophically and logically as well.

I know the questions you mentioned - I would never receive the response you received if I asked my pastor. Shame of those people. How do you think the people of the churches you were in could really teach you truth and answer your questions when they were living like they didn't believe it themselves? Did you ever really come to the point of finding true worth in God? I don't mean the emotional high of "being on fire" for him, but really coming to grips with who God is, why he deserves our lives to bring him Glory, and that we can truly be satisfied in that.

What did you do with the sexual frustrations you felt? I have a feeling that this area became a struggle for you and had a lot to do with where you are now at. I have been there too. In fact, your "nude art" was tempting to look at. Why, because God has made me a sexual being and I have used that in the wrong ways in the past. He has taught to really be "Freethinking" in that area though. Just like the fish is only free in the sea, for when it desires to be "free” from the water it will die; we are free when we live within the bounds that God has created for us as man and women. One of those bounds is how I satisfy that sexual desire within.

It has been hard, but God has taught me and shown me that I can have an amazing, free, open and intimate relationship with my wife and it will be full of true satisfaction. It really comes down to what is best. Does masturbation or sex outside of marriage feel good? No need to answer. But those ways of meeting that desire are only inferior to what God really wants us to know and experience. And that comes to the point of what makes one sin and not the other.

I should trust that what God says is best is best and be willing to wait for it. When I do that it brings Him glory. If I show that I don't trust Him by finding other ways than His was to meet that desire - it doesn't bring him glory and it is sin. So when I'm tempted to look at your "art", I have a decision to make - is what God offers better? It what God has commanded me to do worth ignoring the photos and waiting for the opportunity to have an open, intimate time with my wife? Absolutely! Sorry for that rant, but I want you to know that I am not here as some pious fool who thinks he knows everything and has it all together.

I really believe that you and I have experienced some of the same sad examples of the church and personal struggles. That doesn't mean that it is all bunk. You know that for every unbelieving "freethinker" out there, that there are just as many believing thinkers that can defend the truth of Christianity against any argument. Funny how the way we choose to believe is the side we are on - is it worth risking eternity on it?

The questions beg an answer. I hope you will....

Jon